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LockedStickyTHIS IS NOT A CURE-ALL
There are a large variety of issues that affect settler AI, and this mod serves as documentation and a fix for an extremely specific bug that, to the best of my knowledge, only affects large mod-added or edited settlements. I am investigating other issues that affect settler AI, and in particular I have found one specific cause that needs further investigation but would, if true, cause significant and verifiable breakage.
All right, so I've been looking into Abernathy Farm as requested and have found several causes for issues encountered there:- Lucy's bed is "inaccessible" from her perspective, because the navmesh it is sitting on is completely isolated from the rest of the world by a stray precut.
- Blake and Connie's beds are also "inaccessible" to them because they're facing the wrong way. If you select one of their two mattresses in console and run the command "modangle z 180" they will immediately "find" the bed and be able to sleep in it.
- Blake and Connie's beds are explicitly owned by them in the base game, and a large variety of mods carry this ownership forward rather than using the unofficial patch's ownership changes. This ownership breaks their bed assignment when a workshop resets, which happens anytime you leave the area and come back.
- When using the unofficial patch, their beds are unowned and thus work properly. However, when you assign a new bed to them this can break their sleep package and you may need to leave the area and return in order to get that working.
- Lucy's bed is "inaccessible" from her perspective, because the navmesh it is sitting on is completely isolated from the rest of the world by a stray precut.
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How effective has the EXT part of this mod been, if at all? I'm looking to test it out a bit myself.
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So idk if it's in the scope of the midnight cult fix -ext but is it possible to fix the settler behavior wanting to go through walls instead of using doors?
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Hrm. After installing the mod, letting several in-game days go by (naturally, not by force-sleeping) and spending half an hour (realtime) standing in an interior cell (small bunker), half of Starlight is still standing around the dead center of the lot, staring each other down. Is Starlight not affected by this specific fix?
I have folks just standing around the center of Sanctuary and the Castle as well but it doesn't seem to have anything to do with nightfall so oh well.
I've pretty much given up on settlers doing any of their jobs at this point. You were my last hope, Obi-Wan. Ah well, thanks anyway.-
The AI package I updated is only used by settlers between midnight and 8AM, so if you see the problem at all times of day it's likely to be another issue that affects pathfinding and/or NPC AI. You can check to see if it's a pathfinding issue by using console to move one of the NPCs to another part of the settlement. If you select the NPC by clicking them, you can then use "moveto player" in console and it will move them to you.
If they stay where you moved them, then the likely issue is the pathfinding, and the cause is probably from stacking navmeshed workshop objects too closely. If they walk back to the center of the settlement, then pathfinding is working properly and their AI is at fault instead.
With all that said, I just uploaded a copy of the test build that I had been getting people to give me testing and feedback data on. It's under miscellaneous files. The test build applies the same fix to all AI packages used by settlers in settlements, which should extend the effect of this fix to the entire ingame day. The warning on that file is because there's a small chance that Bethesda relied on this broken behavior elsewhere in the game, sort of like how Morrowind AI has a bug with pathfinding AI that, if fixed, will result in several NPCs swimming out to sea after their quests are complete. -
will result in several NPCs swimming out to sea after their quests are complete.
....omg lol i'm dying. I never knew that. Hoo boy.
At this point I'd say it's worth the risk to try at least.... i thought the issue all these years was my crap machine and script lag and not throttling mods enough, but today on a new PC with modern hardware Bethesduh AI and pathfinding STILL sucks. -_-
Cheers for the tip
I'll let you know if anyone tries to swim to Fah Hahbah -
Has EXT helped your settlement issues at all? It has a much broader coverage, which is part of why I really wanted to do a lot more testing prior to sharing it since that coverage is both a blessing and a curse.
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I'm honestly not sure. There are still people standing around the center of Starlight, my most built-up settlement, at all hours.
I have also installed the Navmesh Fix for several locations to eliminate that as a variable.
However, while it may be too soon to tell, it feels like there's less "idlers" in the damn water pit (gg Todd, putting the center marker in the damn water pit, ffs). I'll see 2-4 at most at any given moment, instead of there routinely being half a dozen or more all clustered 'round doing nothing.
TL;DR tentatively yes i think, so far so good. At worst, I haven't noticed anything breaking other than the issues noticed with those in the NoPackages factions which is now fixed.
EDIT: thinking about my observations more, this may be a bit of a catch-22 situation. Because I noticed that for a while, shopkeepers for instance would actually go to their damn counters for once, but then a short time later, they'd be just standing around near their stores again. So i wonder if EXT is interrupting the "be a shopkeeper and stand on the damn marker" package?
Would it be possible to test this by exempting certain AI packages from being interrupted? I hate to turn a simple fix into a complex overhaul, but if it for example had a list of certain packages - jobs - not to halt, like manning Artillery or a shop counter marker - that might be a huge improvement to the game :O -
I actually can't blame Todd for this one - the center marker is actually between the water pit and the concession stand. The NPCs are actually idling as close to the center of the settlement's sandbox area as they can get, which in this case happens to be the water.
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Ah I see, fair enough. I likely have built on top of the center marker then.
Just updated previous post with an idea, lemme know what you think. -
Packages are evaluated several times a minute, and each step in the package has its conditions evaluated as part of that process. Unless you have your shops way out near (or beyond) the edge of the settlement, I don't really see that happening.
For context, the faulty portion of the package is a "Travel" package, which is set up to make the NPC travel to the settlement. This is mostly a safety measure in case NPCs are super far away from whatever they're supposed to be doing, and in the case of settlement NPCs it typically shouldn't need to run at all.
With that said, the travel package appears to have a flaw when the destination is a large enough area - it simply never completes, which results in the NPC "traveling" to the center of their destination forever. I added a condition on that travel package that ensures it only runs when the NPC is outside of the destination area. In the case of settlers, that typically means they have to be outside the settlement sandbox, and the sandbox itself typically overflows past the settlement boundaries. For starlight, that sandbox is the big red box in this screenshot:
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so THAT'S why i see these f*kers wandering around that little hilltop....
OK, thanks. So the other standing-around-ness is nothing to do with the flaw this mod fixes, then. Ah well. After all these years I thought we'd finally be able to make those lazy sods get back to work xD
FWIW, they definitely ARE, on average, manning their various posts more than they used to, likely as an effect of them not being on the Road to Nowhere forever any more.
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Thanks for this. I'm new to Fallout 4. Was so disappointed when all my hard work settlement building seemed to be pointless since everyone would just stand around all day and night doing nothing. This has greatly helped both the bedtime issues and just general sandbox issues. I came back to Sanctuary today to actually see Dogmeat in her doghouse!
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I have noticed this weirdness with some unique npcs like the two hunters that hide near a cage with that one trader's dog in there and when you unlock the cage they are scripted to attack you. These two hunters bug out for me and attack the dog while it is still in the cage because they spawn very near and inside the cage when I first arrive in the area. This didn't happen earlier in the year I think it is because of some mods I have installed and or some F4SE mods installed to extend fallout 4 so it ain't so buggy with too many mods loaded and to bypass the BA2 limit like the x-cell mod for example. For YEARS though I always got the bug with mines in dungeons exploding the moment I enter the dungeon instead of lying in wait as they should be doing.
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FWIW I'm pretty sure the mines issue is actually related to silly errors Beth made with their factions. I've noticed similar things with some mines and traps - the locals are incorrectly not in the same faction as the mines and traps, so as soon as the area loads, if the locals are near a mine, it detonates because it detects a non-ally near it -_- this has been a thing since release and Beth has no will to fix it.
However, this mod works mostly by putting a stop to an AI package running too long... i don't think there's any way this mod could CHANGE a raider's hostility from you to their own dog. So it's something else. Maybe even vanilla bugs. I have frequently noticed groups of Rust Devils spawning along with their robots, and they immediately begin killing each other /eyeroll
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this may not be a cure all, but it's the 1st attmpt to address this as bnest as I can tell, thank you for that.
DLed, endorsed asap and tracking -
Secure_Message_Incoming:
"Enclave Commander of CVN-69 USS EDEN wishes to convey his gratitude for your assistance in resolving the insomnia situation on board the vessel without having to resort to mandatory narcautics doses in the infirmary."
Seriously, now most of the troops will actually use their bunks instead of clustering up in the secondary hangar or in front of the infirmary in the USS Eden settlement mod. That's a pretty big settlement. Thanks for porting this to xbox. -
Does this work with all the Sim Settlements?
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does this work with fallout 4 last gen?
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Thanks to your open permissions, I have ported the mod to both consoles and PC on Bethesda.net (for steam deck users convenience). Thank you once again! <3
Xbox Download
PlayStation Download
PC (Steam Deck) Download
