Questions and Answers Last updated: September 6, 2022
Please read this before asking any questions. If you feel you have a bug to report, please submit a bug report after verifying that it is indeed a bug and not something mentioned here in the FAQ. Please do not PM me about any issues. I will not respond. That being said, here you will find answers to some common questions and concerns:
• Version 1.1.2 is the latest version and the most stable.
• "Can you put this on PS4?" No. You can thank the suits over at Sony for that one.
• "The courier isn't delivering the notes to me." This is a problem with your save game and needs to be sorted out independently. It is not an issue with the mod. There are a number of reasons why this could be happening, such as mod conflicts, load order issues, just to name a few.
• "So and so isn't appearing! What can I do?" First of all, don't panic. It is recommended to play through this mod on a new save, or a save that has relatively few mods active. The Brotherhood of Old is a very script heavy mod, and the Skyrim scripting engine has a hard time keeping up with everything going on when it's under heavy usage from other mods. You can still play this mod on your heavily modded saves, and most of the time you should be fine, but do be prepared to run into issues where certain NPCs aren't appearing, someone's glitching through the ground, you getting stuck because a quest stage is not firing, and so on. You can try running FallrimTools script cleaner on your saves, I've heard that fixes a lot of problems people are having.
• "Nothing happens when I hit Agnar Hollowleg with the Night's Shade Dagger. Is it possible to recruit him?" The dagger is designed to not work on him. This is a scripted event that is supposed to fail. Agnar will never join the Dark Brotherhood under any circumstances. Believe me, I've tried to convince him and he wasn't having any of it.
• "Can I install this before I have completed the Dark Brotherhood questline?" Yes, you can.
• "Can I use this if I've done the "Destroy the Dark Brotherhood!" quest?" No, sorry. It's not possible at this time.
• "Can I use console commands to skip [insert part here]? Can you tell me what the stage ID is?" No. You're breaking things. Stop breaking things. If you feel you've run into an issue, make a bug report for the issue you're experiencing. Make sure to include as much detail as possible, including what stage you're currently on in the quest you're doing. I cannot help you if you can't provide me with the necessary information. Please look through the bug reports to see if someone has already reported your issue first, however.
• "This mod adds something in the way of something your mod adds. What can I do?" I unfortunately don't have time to make a patch for every little incompatibility there may be. If you run into something, please inform me about it and I will add it to the incompatibilities list. There may already be a patch for your issue. If not, you are free to make and post one yourself. Please let me know if you've done so.
• "Why haven't you answered my question? Did you get my PM. PLS RESPOND THX" I'm a one man team. I'm handling everything myself. I work a full time job in addition to numerous other projects and obligations. I physically do not have the time or manpower to get back to each and every one of you. There are a lot of you and only one me. Please follow the appropriate steps if you run into an issue before heading to the comments and my private messages. I don't mean to sound rude... that's just how things are. Thank you for the support. I appreciate you checking out my work
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1.1.2 known issues:
• There is a Bugthesda problem with the weapon racks in the player home version of Amatius manor. You can put weapons on them but you can't take them back. I've tried all the known fixes and nothing is working. Don't use the weapon racks if you want your weapons back.
To ensure your bug report is seen, please do not post about them in the comment section or send me a private message about them. This includes posting to or messaging me on Reddit about them, which is the least likely way to get me to see them.
I will not answer or look at any bug reports that aren't posted to bug tracker located here. I will also most likely not reply to them in general unless I require more information about the issue. This DOES NOT mean that I haven't seen your report.
When making a report, please follow these steps:
Check to see if there is already an open report for your issue. Others may be experiencing the same issue.
Please try to include as much information as possible, such as what you were doing when you encountered the issue, how to reproduce it, and a list of mods you are using to check for compatibility issues.
Please do not expect something to be fixed if these basic steps have not been followed. Thank you for your cooperation.
I absolutely love the mod - quests, NPCs, and NPC voices (save for some :V). But yeah, although I do love the mod, it was quite buggy and sometimes the journal doesn't specify what exactly to do, causing some players to be confused. Although I have found workarounds to certain bugs and events. By the way, this is going to be a looooooooooooooooong ass post as it contains bugs I've experienced and what I did or what could be done.
THIS POST HAS SPOILERS, SO READ AT YOUR OWN RISK I write/ post to maybe help other who are stuck on certain stages and bug report (of course, I'll also write a report at the bug tracker tab if it wasn't already stated or addressed)
EDIT: I don't know what the heck happened as I post this wall of text, but the formatting got all messed up :V
A FEW NOTES Before I delve into the workarounds, there are a few things that is worth noting. And they are:
I have around 700 mods and plugins installed.
The Brotherhood of Old (TBO)v.1.1.2 was installed mid-playthrough.
I know I may have already broken some of the AI or scripts with what I'm doing XD (but things worked out in the end soooo ¯\_(ツ)_/¯).
Most of the things I write here would be regarding bugs (I hope) and very little on NPC's being slow in completing their scripted actions since it was already stated by the author that heavy modding causes scripts to be read more slowly.
As I write this post, the only quest I have finished (I think) from YCM is 'Arch Enemies'. I also don't know what next to do buuuut welp :V. There may be quests that were altered because of YCM. I've been reading some reports in the bug reports tab and see quests that were posted there that I haven't experienced or played. So it's either caused by STDB or YCM since I only have three DB mods that alters and/or adds quests. Either that or I misunderstood something.
Next, about all the bugs and workarounds I have done so far when playing the mod. I haven't had any major problems until I got to the quest 'Baby Steps'. It's the quest where you take Undil on his first mission/ contract. The only things I've experienced so far were a delay in script reading as stated by this mod in the description due to heavy modding and installing the mod mid-playthrough.
GENERAL BUGS
Let's talk about some general bugs I've experienced and read from others'. One thing I've noticed is that, unlike most quests that has dialogues between two or more NPC's, the NPCs from TBO doesn't require the NPCs in question to be in a distance range. As long as the PC gets close enough to trigger the script, the dialogue starts. So let's say even if Undil is at least 5000 units away from me and I approach the Thalmor guard, the dialogue starts (I can only hear the guard's dialogue and not Undil's since I'm near the former). Or as long as they are in the same cell and the PC activates/ initiates conversation, the script will run regardles of the NPC's distance when conversing (e.g. Undil and the argonian in Candlehearth Hall, Undil and the Thalmor guard in the vicinity of the Thalmor Prison, Vala and the Frightened Salesman - Percius Crito - in The Winking Skeever, etc.).
When the quests from TBO prompts the PC to 'commune' with the Night Mother while the quest 'The Dark Brotherhood Forever (DB radiant quest after completing 'Hail Sithis')' is active (speak to the night mother), the radiant quest would take priority. After the script of the Night Mother finishes for the radiant quest, the TBO quest wont proceed as the Night Mother won't speak again. Solution: Exiting and entering the sanctuary fixes this.
There are quests which makes an NPC hostile to the PC and others, not. NPCs which should not have any aggression or hostility to the PC become hostile and attack. It may even make completing a quest impossible, thus stopping the whole questline from ever finishing. Solution: Reduce number of followers you currently have following you (ideally, zero and only followers from the mod should follow you when playing the mod main questlines). Alt Solution: Use the resurrect console command (although there is a chance it may break the AI of the NPC during a certain quest).Alt Solution: Using the disable and enable command may also break certain NPC AI, but may work sometimes.
Azuk seems to always enter and exit the Dawnstar Sanctuary from the hidden entrance (Sithis Stained Glass). I thought he would permanently stay in the sanctuary after I completed the side quest One Small Favor but he keeps exiting, disappearing, and entering the sanctuary.
As I've written earlier, I use MHIYH almost everytime, given I'm not lazy and just fast travel normally. I set an NPC's home to the area in front of the Sithis Stained Glass Window/Panel. Where the fireplace, cooking area, dining area, and secondary entry is located. When the journal prompts the PC to return to the sanctuary, I just teleport using MHIY. As soon as I'm in the sactuary, the journal doesn't update. Solution: Just make your way towards the main entry of the sanctuary and the area after the stairs is will update the journal.
Not sure if this is a bug or just a mesh issue. The border between entering The Chamber of Sorrow in the Winterhold Sanctuary is quite far when exiting from said cell. In other words, when you exit the chamber, you are technically inside the space before you enter the next area. Think of when you enter a cave. As you approach it, first you would see the text "To <Location>". Move a bit further and you would freeze and the screen would turn black as you enter the location. In this case, the PC is inside the transition area. Solution: When exiting, just move forward. Moving back far enough then moving forward will cause the PC to enter the chamber.
QUEST: BABY STEPS
Firstly, regarding the Baby Steps quest, Undil sometimes doesn't say his lines. It's just blank. A few seconds later, the quest journal and objectives get updated. So, not much of an issue. After this, some other NPC's will also have missing lines but the journal updates anyway.
In this quest, I chose the option to kill everyone - Justiciars and Prisoners. I found the Thalmors and the prisoner in question and now I have to kill the "Justiciars" according to the journal. Killed them and now told me to equip the Prisoner's Roughspun Tunic. It was confusing here at first but since I decided to kill everyone, I killed him as well and equiped the tunic. Quest objectives didn't update after that and it seems like it froze. Solution: Talk to Undil and let him equip the Thalmor robes and the quest prompts you to now go to the Thalmor Prison.
When you've reached the prison and approach the guard, the script dialogue plays regardless if Undil is nead the guard or not.
When you've reached the prison, the guard wearing an elven armour set has an animation as if she died but would still have the 'Talk' interaction. Although she won't talk to you at all. Solution: Enter the prison, get out, and she would be back to normal.Alt Solution:Recycleactor may work but meh, no need.
After the dialogue ends, the guard is supposed to unlock the door to the prison but somehow can't climb the stairs. He wanders from the bottom of the stairs to the right side corner of the building and does nothing else. It's probably a mesh and/or pathfinding issue. Solution: Open console, select the guard who is supposed to open the door, get close to the prison door, the use moveto player command. This may or may not work as it can be trial and error. The guard may just step back and wander around again or actually unlocks the door. So just kep trying. Alt Solution: I haven't tried this but perhaps the door could be opened by selecting the door in console and then typing unlock.
When you're inside the prison, Undil wouldn't move up the stairs. Solution:Moveto player command again near the door at the second floor.
The progression is smooth thus far until the next few quests but in here, there is the objective to kill Medora (note, I chose to kill all the prisoners and guards). Journal prompted me to kill Medora, but I found her already dead. Solution: I used the resurrect command on her then killed her, then the optional objective of killing the other prisoners appeared.
Just to be sure since I wanted to get the bonus reward of killing everyone, I returned to the prison and killed the Thalmor guards. The problem here is that, their aggression is still set to 0 even after witnessing their ally being killed in front of them. Same is true with the guards outside the prison and the two guards who were escorting the prisoner .
QUEST: THE DASTARDLY DUO
The quest proceeds smoothly from the end of Baby Steps to the point of deciding the fate of Camas, the woman (forgot her name), and the two children. When you tracked Camas down and found the children, the woman will be teleported (I think) to you. When you interact with any of them, it would say that they are busy but nothing happens. Solution: Make sure J'Zakar and M'Jirra (Khajiit twins) are near the woman. Solution: Waiting it out usually works (don't use the wait function). Solution: Push the woman closer to Camas and dialogue would proceed. Solution: If you have multiple followers like me, they may be blocking the path of either of the NPCs. Lead them away or, like me, use MHIYH and move group to me (crossair). This could solve the issue.
Save the game here and decide who would you let the twins kill. Choosing to kill both or no one (probably) would have no effect on succeeding quests (them poor kids when you kill both Camas and the woman XD). Choosing to kill one of them somehow aggrevates the other and turns them hostile towards the PC. This makes the quest impossible to complete Solution:(I chose to kill the woman) Camas died and when everyone was waiting, I sheathed my weapons and used resurrect console command on Camas. Talked to him and dialogue continued smoothly. Note: If you decide to kill both, the journal would prompt you to speak with the woman (even though she is dead). Resurrect her and speaking to her will not initiate any conversation, making it impossible to comlete the quest.
QUEST: A WITCH IN WHITERUN
In the objective where the PC has to buy upgrades for the Markarth and Winterhold Sanctuaries from Delvin Mallory, I purchased the upgrades for 35k septims. I noticed late but the sanctuaries have not been upgraded or changed at all. I watched a guide and saw the interiors are different (saw the Winterhold Sanctuary change but not the Markarth Sanctuary). It may be because the mod was installed mid-playthrough or something.
QUEST: AN ORC WALKS INTO A BAR
The only bug I experienced here was when I need to meet Azuk at Smuggler's Hollow (I chose to give Azuk a second chance). When you enter the cave, Azuk is there, and directly heads for the exit. After his script line, he essentially disappears from the cave and the journal prompts the PC to talk to Azuk (but then again, he isn't in the cave). Solution: There is some time before Azuk exits the cave. Open the console, get his RefID, then proceed to loot the area. When the journal prompts the PC to talk to Azuk, open the console again and type in the player.moveto <RefID> command. Speak to him and the quest should complete as normal.
QUEST: A BREATH OF FRESH AIR
If you have a mod that changes The Frozen Hearth Inn in Morthal and you installed TBO mid-playthrough, you will notice the argonian Oleen-Tei missing from the cellar. I have COTN Morthal and TGC of Winterhold (this is a mistake on my part since I'm not sure if I installed TGC Winterhold mid-playthrough or it was another mod). Anyways, Oleen-Tei would not appear in the cellar connected to the but is still on the same space/cell. Solution: Open your local map and find the marker. Once you've located him, use the tcl console command and go to him (don't forget to activate collision or tcl once your return to the normal space). Speak to him and the quest should proceed as normal. You can save his RefID for the moveto player command. You can go back to the normal cellar, use moveto player command so he will be in that space, then continue with the quest. Or just save his RefID later on so you can use moveto player command to complete the quest.
QUEST: SIBLING RIVALRY
So, in this quest, I teleported directly inside the Falkreath Sanctuary via MHIYH. There were no NPC's inside (save from the OG Astrid hanging out at the open space). I got Wulf's Journals and at the same time, the time was now midnight. Nice coincidence. Then the journal prompted me to speak with Nazir. I've read that there are supposed to be Vampire Brotherhood members, but I suppose they were supposed to be outside the sanctuary.
QUEST: THE CULTS OF DARKNESS
When you speak to Nazir about some circumstances, he will tell you that someone from the Morag Tong has come to visit the Dawnstar Sanctuary. After speaking with the Dunmer, Feril Ralvayn, in the torture chamber, he turns hostile no matter the coversation selection you choose. But after his script ends, he just dies suddenly instead of fighting you. Quest objectives will proceed as normal
In the objective where the PC has to speak with Arine, she may not be inside the Dawnstar Sanctuary and is somewhere in Dawnstar city. I tried looking for her based on her map marker but the marker won't show up in the local map Solution: Go as close as possible to her world map marker and cast Detect Life. You should be able to find her essense or something with it.
After investigating the cave (The Fringe Sanctum) far northwest of Dawstar with Arine and the Khajiit Twins, you will have to speak and later on engage with Banus Alor and a Morag Tong Assassin. When you return to the Dawnstar Sanctuary, you would find the Khajiit Twins and Percius Crito near the area of the Night Mother. Try interacting with them and it would say that the person is busy. Solution: Get Nazir's RefIF (0001C3AD) and use the moveto player console command. Quest should proceed normally. Alt Solution: Waiting a few in-game hours might work (I haven't tried this). Note: I'm not sure if the body of Banus should be present in the area as well. When I returned to the twins, there was a body there and after I moved Nazir to my location, he first moved to the body and his scripts activated. Note: Before I moved Nazir to my location in the Dawnstar Sanctuary, I first move to him and he was somewhere southeast of Dawnstar traversing a mountain slope, perhaps moving to Dawnstar :V Dunno where the heck he's going.
When you return to The Fringe Sanctum to frame the Vampire Dark Brotherhood Group (Forgot their organisation; Red Scar, I think... forgot), you would have to kill Percius with the Languorwine Blade (optional to loot him of his belongings). I had Serana as one of my followers and she apparently revived Percius as an undead. Solution: Proceed with the quest as prompted (planting the Writ of Assassination in the Evidence Chest, Waiting in the prison cell, and Speaking with Vhosek) and wait for the objective to revive Percius. Kill him (or rather, Serana's undead creature), loot him AGAIN in his ash dust form ehe he he XD (optional), then place the antidote on him like so. He should revive from the ashes like some miracle magic and the quest should proceed as normal.
QUEST: TWO SOULS, ONE DESTINY
The first thing the PC does in this quest is to appoint the Khajiit Twins as Speakers. I also don't know why they don't return to the Dawnstar Sanctuary after the events of the previous quest. They remain in The Fringe Sanctum.
When you appoint a leader for each Sanctuary, you have four options (J'Zakar, M'Jirra, Babette, and Nazir). I don't think you can appoint Azuk as a leader since he isn't a Speaker (I think that's how it goes). So there are three Sanctuaries and four options. You can appoint Babbette and the Khajiit Twins via conversation and select the option directly. Only Nazir has a unique dialogue. Initiating a conversation with him would give the option "Nazir." This would then reveal that you can appoint him as a leader of any of the three sanctuaries. Exiting the conversation before appointing him would remove the option permanently. Solution: Revert back to an old save. Alt Solution: Appoint the other three as Leaders.
The PC will be prompted to return to The Chamber of Sorrows in the Winterhold Sanctuary. There may be a chance the door is missing and thus cannot enter the sanctuary and proceed with the quest. Solution: Save the game and quit to the Main Menu, and reloading the save. The door should be respawned. Solution: Fast travel to another area and fast travel back to the WInterhold Sanctuary. The door should be respaw.ned. Solution: Enter another cell (Like an inn), exit, and return back. The door should be respawned. Alt Solution: Use the tcl console command and go between the ground and where the door should be. Open the console and click around. I found a RefID, but I'm not sure if it belongs to the door (XX00e2b0). Then type recycleactor in the console.
When you enter The Chamber of Sorrows, you would see all the necessary actors: - Nazir - Babette - J'Zakar - M'Jirra - Undil - Lechance - NecromancerSometimes, Nazir may not be present (He disappeared three times in this quest alone for my playthrough :V). Besides Nazir, Vala may also not be present in the cell. Vala may not be present since the mod requires her to follow you, which technically makes her a follower. The Chamber of Sorrows might have the restriction where followers are not allowed to follow you. Since Vala is a follower, it restricted her from entering. Solution: In the console, type prid 0001C3AD(Nazir RefID), press enter, then type moveto player, then press enter again. Nazir should be moved to the PC. Solution: In the console, type prid XX01cacc(Vala RefID), press enter, then type moveto player, then press enter again. Vala should be moved to the PC. Change the XX to your mod index. Note: Well for those who has her, Sofia will always bypass any of these follower restricted/banned areas
There's this event that also happened which caused my HUDs to disappear and when I press esc, I have two cursors - one is frozen in the screen as if it was part of the world/scene and another cursor, the cursor we see when navigating through the menu. So far, this only happened when I loaded a save to decide what happens to Vala. Solution: Quiting to Main Menu and reloading that save normalised things.
Initially, I chose to stop the ritual. I was curious as to what happens when I choose to proceed. Loaded an earlier save and the bug written above happened. Reloaded from Main Menu to normalise things, and when I now chose to proceed, Nazir disappeared and Vala won't go to her position (This is when Nazir disappeared three times. Two times when I chose to stop the ritual). Solution: Use prid <RefID> and moveto player console commands. There is a chance it's just the scripts being delayed.
When the Necromancer does his thing to Vala and Lechance, Nazir walks toward the exit. Prid <RefID> and moveto player again.
After the Necromancer does his thing, Vala would have some kind of greenish glow (imagine Pokemon reduce SPD effect with the green colour), Nazir disappears AGAIN! Prid <RefID> and moveto player.
I didn't want to continue this part anymore but I assume it would be the same flow from here, more or less. Four members from the Vampire Dark Brotherhood will appear after checking on Vala and speaking with Lechance. There might have been some mesh or pathfinding error again as it took some effort of pushing them down the slope. Solution: Talking to Wulf either way would progress the quest.
After killing them, even if no one passed you and touched the other members, M'Jirra would die as it is scripted. Check and make sure that the necessary actors are still in the area. Once you made sure they are, save the game as it may be buggy from here.
QUEST: THE TRUE BROTHERHOOD
Nazir, Babbette, Undil, and Vala will make their way out of the cell with the objective Lead the Dark Brotherhood. The important NPC here is Nazir, at least from my playthrough. Undil, Vala, and finally Nazir exited the chamber and that's when the objectives updated. Babbete didn't exit yet the journal updated. The journal prompts the PC to speak with Vala, which she would teleport to the Dawnstar Sanctuary. This is where your previous save may come in handy as not all NPCs may exit. Or they may have all exited yet the journal does not update. Solution: Reload old save. Alt Solution: Usingprid <RefID> and moveto player console command, bring them back to the chamber and let them exit again.
Once the PC has spoken with Vala, she would be appointed as a Speaker (or leader... I forgot) and would equip the robes, and head for the exit of the Dawnstar Sanctuary for whatever reason. This completed the quest and ends the TBO Main Questline. Now, even if it's complete, there's a chance Vala may be lost and wandering about. Solution: If she was your follower before (which is most likely), she would still act as one and even fast travel with the PC. Solution: Use MHIYH and teleport to her. Her dialogue options should still be that of a follower.
And this ends my looooooooong ass bug report and posibly guide to other players experiencing the same things as I did. Hoped this wall of text helps anyone who experiences the same thing or those who might want to know what happens while playing the mod.
I've posted some bugs that were not mentioned before or were mntioned but from previous versions.
Hey, I'm at the end of the questline, and my question concerns Vala. When she wanders off at the end of the questline, she actually goes to Amatius manor and sits in front of the fireplace. Problem is, the follower dialogue still works, but when I get her to follow me, she stays put, and doesn't fast travel with me. She still has the follower dialogue, but doesn't go anywhere. Do you know anything about this too?
I've read that some others experience this as well with Vala and other followers. I also experienced it with Gabriella and EFF (I was experimenting with some stuff). Tried many things and I think it conflicts with other mods. If not, maybe a script error or something.
So it could be something to do with EFF? I tried reloading an old save and the same thing still happens, she can't be added to MHIYH either, so I don't know if that works either. I previously had her managed with EFF during the questline, could that also be a problem?
Thoroughly enjoyable mod and questline. I wish it was longer. However, I'm not entirely pleased with the stupid jester coming back and being unkillable...
One thing I would love is a constant repeatable quest to listen to the night mother to hand out contracts to the other brothers and sisters
Just trying to find out if this mod is compatible with the Dark Brotherhood Rising Revengeance mod. Have looked through over 10 pages of posts here and all 6 pages of posts for RR and can’t find anything. Google AI says they’re not compatible, but who knows how accurate that actually is… Really only interested in the alternate way to begin the Destroy the Dark Brotherhood quest from RR (for a good guy character that doesn’t want to commit murder to then destroy a group of people who commit murder). Has anyone tried using both? Do they play nice, or is it “choose wisely” of one mod or the other?
Hi. I killed Allian Mede and nothing happens. passed days actually not days maybe a month in game time since I killed him but nothing happens. What Should I do?
I really wanna keep this mod but it adds a lot of buildings and objects everywhere, which conflicts with the many other mods I have. It would be very helpful to know exactly all the big locations this mod adds to the world.
I don't get the notice to start... no courier finds me to hand me the notice... I don't fast travel because I play survival and that's not an option in survival... I've tried to turn off survival and fast travel for this purpose only, same thing, no courier finds me to give me the starting notice...
I even found a random courier on the road, while moving from point A to point B and talked to him and nothing for me...
I'm on PC, via Steam installed with MO2, it's my last in the load order and I barely have 20 other mods, mainly player houses and better vampires... it's March 2025 if the mod is still monitored to the present day...
Hey all. I will be working on a content update to address some issues and add new things. Sound off below if you would like to see anything in particular.
Thanks author, and seems like the perfect moment for this then:
There's a new mod called "For the Love of Babette" that takes place after "Where you hang your enemy's head", so after "Hail Sithis". It gives a quest for Babette to grow up, and transforms her into a new version of herself.🤔
I wonder if it would be possible to delay either quests... Since Babette won't be available three days after restoring the sanctuary...but it's just a suggestion, there might be other things to look into. Anyway the options are up to both of you mod authors, I just wanted to bring this to your attention.
That new Babette mod is revolutionary in my opinion.😌
Edit: the author said SSEedit didn't detect any conflicts between his mod and yours.
I would like to see you get rid of the pointless copy of the Silver Blood Inn, which remains after you complete the quest, breaking literally every other quest that relies on the Silver Blood Inn. And I would like to see proper facegen for your NPCs. Your khajiit don't have facetints, so they're a weird, buggy mess in the face area.
I am aware that this may not be something that you would want to do, but it would be great if there was a file that had the Quest IDs and essential item IDs, which I think would help many people fix their own bugs, as they would be able to advance the quest if the automatic trigger does not fire. I don't know how modding works though, so I don't know if this would be a desirable, or even possible, option.
Make the khajiits in the tent outside whiterun non-existant until needed by quest OR even better make them neutral to the player and give them a couple of lines of dialogue for them to make sense if you speak with them before the quest.
Thirding having the khajiit and their tent be disabled until their quest needs them. This would improve compatibility with mods that edit the Whiterun outskirts.
Regarding Baby Steps, the placement of a Thalmor office complete with justiciars a stone's throw from Windhelm, capital of the Stormcloaks, to me is a bit jarring. I believe it would make more sense for the Thalmor to be operating out of a less conspicuous and easily concealable safehouse, such as a cave or underground pit, that deep behind enemy lines.
I am a downloader of your mod and a HUGE fan. I read your latest article about changes and I have a suggestion for what ti do with the Morag Tong. A couple actually. Either A. Make them a third joinable faction and have whatever faction you join their quest to destroy the other two (brotherhood is Scars and Tong for example.) I got this idea from the Skyrim creation “A Tale of Blood and Snow” where it was a three way battle between the Vigil of Stendarr, the Cronvangr Vampire Clan and the Quarra Vampire Clan. The faction you would join would destroy the other two you didn’t join. I thought this would be a cool thing for fans of the Tong. Or B, if you are staunchly opposed to the players joining them, add them in anyway but make them the secondary antagonists, like whichever faction you are a part of (the Brotherhood or the Scars) you will have to deal with and defeat them either way. I liked their inclusion in the mod so I would like to see them in this mod. That’s the only suggestion I had. Thank you for making this mod. It’s in my top 5! I can’t wait for the changes you are going to make (do you have a planned time to do it in or a release date?). That’s all, thank you again for making this mod again!
I'd ask that any changes you are making to the world space remain compatible with JKSkyrim &/or JK Dark Brotherhood Sanctuary. As JK's mods are some of the most popular world space overhauls on the Nexus avoiding conflicts with them (or even active integration with them) would be awesome!
• "The courier isn't delivering the notes to me." This is a problem with your save game and needs to be sorted out independently. It is not an issue with the mod. There are a number of reasons why this could be happening, such as mod conflicts and load order issues, just to name a few.
so, how do we fix this, mate??
I'm on PC, Skyrim SE latest version via Steam Feb 2025, and using MO2 for mod management
installed with MO2, and I traveled all over, and the letter - quest starter - is not delivered to me...
also, have you considered that some of us play in Survival mode, as such fast travel is not allowed while in Survival..??..
nonetheless, I've disabled Survival, traveled again all around, the letter is not delivered to me...
this mod is the last on my load order, and I barely have maybe 10-15 other mods installed, exactly to avoid and minimize conflicts...
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Please read this before asking any questions. If you feel you have a bug to report, please submit a bug report after verifying that it is indeed a bug and not something mentioned here in the FAQ. Please do not PM me about any issues. I will not respond. That being said, here you will find answers to some common questions and concerns:
• Version 1.1.2 is the latest version and the most stable.
• "Can you put this on PS4?"
No. You can thank the suits over at Sony for that one.
• "The courier isn't delivering the notes to me."
This is a problem with your save game and needs to be sorted out independently. It is not an issue with the mod. There are a number of reasons why this could be happening, such as mod conflicts, load order issues, just to name a few.
• "So and so isn't appearing! What can I do?"
First of all, don't panic. It is recommended to play through this mod on a new save, or a save that has relatively few mods active. The Brotherhood of Old is a very script heavy mod, and the Skyrim scripting engine has a hard time keeping up with everything going on when it's under heavy usage from other mods. You can still play this mod on your heavily modded saves, and most of the time you should be fine, but do be prepared to run into issues where certain NPCs aren't appearing, someone's glitching through the ground, you getting stuck because a quest stage is not firing, and so on. You can try running FallrimTools script cleaner on your saves, I've heard that fixes a lot of problems people are having.
• "Nothing happens when I hit Agnar Hollowleg with the Night's Shade Dagger. Is it possible to recruit him?"
The dagger is designed to not work on him. This is a scripted event that is supposed to fail. Agnar will never join the Dark Brotherhood under any circumstances. Believe me, I've tried to convince him and he wasn't having any of it.
• "Can I install this before I have completed the Dark Brotherhood questline?"
Yes, you can.
• "Can I use this if I've done the "Destroy the Dark Brotherhood!" quest?"
No, sorry. It's not possible at this time.
• "Can I use console commands to skip [insert part here]? Can you tell me what the stage ID is?"
No. You're breaking things. Stop breaking things. If you feel you've run into an issue, make a bug report for the issue you're experiencing. Make sure to include as much detail as possible, including what stage you're currently on in the quest you're doing. I cannot help you if you can't provide me with the necessary information. Please look through the bug reports to see if someone has already reported your issue first, however.
• "This mod adds something in the way of something your mod adds. What can I do?"
I unfortunately don't have time to make a patch for every little incompatibility there may be. If you run into something, please inform me about it and I will add it to the incompatibilities list. There may already be a patch for your issue. If not, you are free to make and post one yourself. Please let me know if you've done so.
• "Why haven't you answered my question? Did you get my PM. PLS RESPOND THX"
I'm a one man team. I'm handling everything myself. I work a full time job in addition to numerous other projects and obligations. I physically do not have the time or manpower to get back to each and every one of you. There are a lot of you and only one me. Please follow the appropriate steps if you run into an issue before heading to the comments and my private messages. I don't mean to sound rude... that's just how things are. Thank you for the support. I appreciate you checking out my work
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1.1.2 known issues:
• There is a Bugthesda problem with the weapon racks in the player home version of Amatius manor. You can put weapons on them but you can't take them back. I've tried all the known fixes and nothing is working. Don't use the weapon racks if you want your weapons back.
To ensure your bug report is seen, please do not post about them in the comment section or send me a private message about them. This includes posting to or messaging me on Reddit about them, which is the least likely way to get me to see them.
I will not answer or look at any bug reports that aren't posted to bug tracker located here.
I will also most likely not reply to them in general unless I require more information about the issue. This DOES NOT mean that I haven't seen your report.
When making a report, please follow these steps:
Please do not expect something to be fixed if these basic steps have not been followed. Thank you for your cooperation.
I write/ post to maybe help other who are stuck on certain stages and bug report (of course, I'll also write a report at the bug tracker tab if it wasn't already stated or addressed)
EDIT:
I don't know what the heck happened as I post this wall of text, but the formatting got all messed up :V
A FEW NOTES
Before I delve into the workarounds, there are a few things that is worth noting. And they are:
- I have around 700 mods and plugins installed.
- The Brotherhood of Old (TBO) v.1.1.2 was installed mid-playthrough.
- Save the Dark Brotherhood - Skyrim SPecial Edition v1.1 was installed mid-playthrough.
- Your Choices Matter - A Dark Brotherhood Expansion SSE (YCM) v2.0.6 was installed mid-playthrough.
-Patch notes are in the above mod's pageAs I write this post, the only quest I have finished (I think) from YCM is 'Arch Enemies'. I also don't know what next to do buuuut welp :V. There may be quests that were altered because of YCM. I've been reading some reports in the bug reports tab and see quests that were posted there that I haven't experienced or played. So it's either caused by STDB or YCM since I only have three DB mods that alters and/or adds quests. Either that or I misunderstood something.
Next, about all the bugs and workarounds I have done so far when playing the mod. I haven't had any major problems until I got to the quest 'Baby Steps'. It's the quest where you take Undil on his first mission/ contract. The only things I've experienced so far were a delay in script reading as stated by this mod in the description due to heavy modding and installing the mod mid-playthrough.
GENERAL BUGS
Solution: Exiting and entering the sanctuary fixes this.
Solution: Reduce number of followers you currently have following you (ideally, zero and only followers from the mod should follow you when playing the mod main questlines). Alt Solution: Use the resurrect console command (although there is a chance it may break the AI of the NPC during a certain quest). Alt Solution: Using the disable and enable command may also break certain NPC AI, but may work sometimes.
Solution: Just make your way towards the main entry of the sanctuary and the area after the stairs is will update the journal.
Solution: When exiting, just move forward. Moving back far enough then moving forward will cause the PC to enter the chamber.
QUEST: BABY STEPS
Solution: Talk to Undil and let him equip the Thalmor robes and the quest prompts you to now go to the Thalmor Prison.
Solution: Enter the prison, get out, and she would be back to normal. Alt Solution: Recycleactor may work but meh, no need.
Solution: Open console, select the guard who is supposed to open the door, get close to the prison door, the use moveto player command. This may or may not work as it can be trial and error. The guard may just step back and wander around again or actually unlocks the door. So just kep trying. Alt Solution: I haven't tried this but perhaps the door could be opened by selecting the door in console and then typing unlock.
Solution: Moveto player command again near the door at the second floor.
Solution: I used the resurrect command on her then killed her, then the optional objective of killing the other prisoners appeared.
QUEST: THE DASTARDLY DUO
Solution: Make sure J'Zakar and M'Jirra (Khajiit twins) are near the woman. Solution: Waiting it out usually works (don't use the wait function).
Solution: Push the woman closer to Camas and dialogue would proceed. Solution: If you have multiple followers like me, they may be blocking the path of either of the NPCs. Lead them away or, like me, use MHIYH and move group to me (crossair). This could solve the issue.
Solution: (I chose to kill the woman) Camas died and when everyone was waiting, I sheathed my weapons and used resurrect console command on Camas. Talked to him and dialogue continued smoothly. Note: If you decide to kill both, the journal would prompt you to speak with the woman (even though she is dead). Resurrect her and speaking to her will not initiate any conversation, making it impossible to comlete the quest.
QUEST: A WITCH IN WHITERUN
- In the objective where the PC has to buy upgrades for the Markarth and Winterhold Sanctuaries from Delvin Mallory, I purchased the upgrades for 35k septims. I noticed late but the sanctuaries have not been upgraded or changed at all. I watched a guide and saw the interiors are different (saw the Winterhold Sanctuary change but not the Markarth Sanctuary). It may be because the mod was installed mid-playthrough or something.
QUEST: AN ORC WALKS INTO A BARSolution: There is some time before Azuk exits the cave. Open the console, get his RefID, then proceed to loot the area. When the journal prompts the PC to talk to Azuk, open the console again and type in the player.moveto <RefID> command. Speak to him and the quest should complete as normal.
QUEST: A BREATH OF FRESH AIR
Solution: Open your local map and find the marker. Once you've located him, use the tcl console command and go to him (don't forget to activate collision or tcl once your return to the normal space). Speak to him and the quest should proceed as normal. You can save his RefID for the moveto player command. You can go back to the normal cellar, use moveto player command so he will be in that space, then continue with the quest. Or just save his RefID later on so you can use moveto player command to complete the quest.
QUEST: SIBLING RIVALRY
QUEST: THE CULTS OF DARKNESS
Solution: Go as close as possible to her world map marker and cast Detect Life. You should be able to find her essense or something with it.
Solution: Get Nazir's RefIF (0001C3AD) and use the moveto player console command. Quest should proceed normally. Alt Solution: Waiting a few in-game hours might work (I haven't tried this).
Note: I'm not sure if the body of Banus should be present in the area as well. When I returned to the twins, there was a body there and after I moved Nazir to my location, he first moved to the body and his scripts activated. Note: Before I moved Nazir to my location in the Dawnstar Sanctuary, I first move to him and he was somewhere southeast of Dawnstar traversing a mountain slope, perhaps moving to Dawnstar :V Dunno where the heck he's going.
Solution: Proceed with the quest as prompted (planting the Writ of Assassination in the Evidence Chest, Waiting in the prison cell, and Speaking with Vhosek) and wait for the objective to revive Percius. Kill him (or rather, Serana's undead creature), loot him AGAIN in his ash dust form ehe he he XD (optional), then place the antidote on him like so. He should revive from the ashes like some miracle magic and the quest should proceed as normal.
QUEST: TWO SOULS, ONE DESTINY
Solution: Revert back to an old save. Alt Solution: Appoint the other three as Leaders.
Solution: Save the game and quit to the Main Menu, and reloading the save. The door should be respawned. Solution: Fast travel to another area and fast travel back to the WInterhold Sanctuary. The door should be respaw.ned. Solution: Enter another cell (Like an inn), exit, and return back. The door should be respawned. Alt Solution: Use the tcl console command and go between the ground and where the door should be. Open the console and click around. I found a RefID, but I'm not sure if it belongs to the door (XX00e2b0). Then type recycleactor in the console.
- Nazir - Babette - J'Zakar - M'Jirra - Undil - Lechance - NecromancerSometimes, Nazir may not be present (He disappeared three times in this quest alone for my playthrough :V). Besides Nazir, Vala may also not be present in the cell. Vala may not be present since the mod requires her to follow you, which technically makes her a follower. The Chamber of Sorrows might have the restriction where followers are not allowed to follow you. Since Vala is a follower, it restricted her from entering. Solution: In the console, type prid 0001C3AD (Nazir RefID), press enter, then type moveto player, then press enter again. Nazir should be moved to the PC. Solution: In the console, type prid XX01cacc (Vala RefID), press enter, then type moveto player, then press enter again. Vala should be moved to the PC. Change the XX to your mod index. Note: Well for those who has her, Sofia will always bypass any of these follower restricted/banned areas
Solution: Quiting to Main Menu and reloading that save normalised things.
Solution: Use prid <RefID> and moveto player console commands. There is a chance it's just the scripts being delayed.
Solution: Talking to Wulf either way would progress the quest.
QUEST: THE TRUE BROTHERHOOD
Solution: Reload old save. Alt Solution: Using prid <RefID> and moveto player console command, bring them back to the chamber and let them exit again.
Solution: If she was your follower before (which is most likely), she would still act as one and even fast travel with the PC. Solution: Use MHIYH and teleport to her. Her dialogue options should still be that of a follower.
And this ends my looooooooong ass bug report and posibly guide to other players experiencing the same things as I did. Hoped this wall of text helps anyone who experiences the same thing or those who might want to know what happens while playing the mod.
I've posted some bugs that were not mentioned before or were mntioned but from previous versions.
Have you tried reloading an old save?
One thing I would love is a constant repeatable quest to listen to the night mother to hand out contracts to the other brothers and sisters
I even found a random courier on the road, while moving from point A to point B and talked to him and nothing for me...
I'm on PC, via Steam installed with MO2, it's my last in the load order and I barely have 20 other mods, mainly player houses and better vampires... it's March 2025 if the mod is still monitored to the present day...
so what can I do to make it work??
how do I start it with console commands??
There's a new mod called "For the Love of Babette" that takes place after "Where you hang your enemy's head", so after "Hail Sithis". It gives a quest for Babette to grow up, and transforms her into a new version of herself.🤔
I wonder if it would be possible to delay either quests... Since Babette won't be available three days after restoring the sanctuary...but it's just a suggestion, there might be other things to look into.
Anyway the options are up to both of you mod authors, I just wanted to bring this to your attention.
That new Babette mod is revolutionary in my opinion.😌
Edit: the author said SSEedit didn't detect any conflicts between his mod and yours.
Regarding Baby Steps, the placement of a Thalmor office complete with justiciars a stone's throw from Windhelm, capital of the Stormcloaks, to me is a bit jarring. I believe it would make more sense for the Thalmor to be operating out of a less conspicuous and easily concealable safehouse, such as a cave or underground pit, that deep behind enemy lines.
This is a problem with your save game and needs to be sorted out independently. It is not an issue with the mod. There are a number of reasons why this could be happening, such as mod conflicts and load order issues, just to name a few.
so, how do we fix this, mate??
I'm on PC, Skyrim SE latest version via Steam Feb 2025, and using MO2 for mod management
installed with MO2, and I traveled all over, and the letter - quest starter - is not delivered to me...
also, have you considered that some of us play in Survival mode, as such fast travel is not allowed while in Survival..??..
nonetheless, I've disabled Survival, traveled again all around, the letter is not delivered to me...
this mod is the last on my load order, and I barely have maybe 10-15 other mods installed, exactly to avoid and minimize conflicts...
so, what can I do to make it work..??..
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